DashCon 2014: The Failed Tumblr Convention and the Ball Pit Meme

[00:00:00] Kyle Risi: Tumblr was a crucible of misfit teens looking for community and belonging in a world where they felt like Outkast posting poems about their despair and arguing about like the Avengers. And so a small group of 20 somethings thought to themselves, what if there was a Tumblr convention where people could meet up with all their online friends in real life?

Adam, this PowerPoint goes up featuring a giant ball pit, And this is the thing that everyone bases their expectations on what this convention is going to be.

[00:00:32] Adam Cox: How big is this ball pit?

[00:00:33] Kyle Risi: Big. According to the inception plants.

they tell the hotel We expect 7,000 guests. Adam On day one, 300 people show up.

[00:00:43] Adam Cox: No,

[00:00:45] Kyle Risi: It is empty except in the centre there is a kiddie size inflatable pool. Oh god. With 300 plastic balls in it. Ah. It's barely big enough.

And one by one the entire room. Start throwing up the three finger salute from the Hunger Games. A rallying cry of the oppressed masses against the tyranny. In this case, the hotel.

Welcome to the Compendium, an Assembly of Fascinating things, a weekly variety podcast that gives you just enough information to stand your ground at any social gathering.

[00:01:43] Adam Cox: We explore strange, true stories from the worlds of true crime, dark history, scandals, mysteries, and of course remarkable people.

[00:01:51] Kyle Risi: I'm, of course, Kyle Reese, your ringmaster for this week's episode.

[00:01:55] Adam Cox: And I'm Adam Cox, the resident dentist for the Iron Jaw Act this week.

[00:01:59] Kyle Risi: What's an iron jaw?

[00:02:01] Adam Cox: The act where someone like holds themself, they're spinning around, but they're being held by their teeth.

[00:02:06] Kyle Risi: Oh God, yes.

[00:02:08] Adam Cox: Well, that's actually really bad for your teeth, oh, really? Yes. Mm-hmm. They brought me in because all of our, acts keep losing their teeth. So I'm there to replace them with some fillings, some new

[00:02:17] Kyle Risi: Make 'em stronger, cement them in there so they don't fall out. Maybe that's just be a prerequisite of the job is just if you want to be this iron Jaw Act. Just have all your teeth removed, reinforce with Adam's special recipe.

[00:02:29] Adam Cox: That sounds weird.

[00:02:30] Kyle Risi: It does. So cement those teeth in and then Yeah, you're fine.

[00:02:33] Adam Cox: Yeah, but that's why, they don't do any photos anymore because they have no teeth.

[00:02:36] Kyle Risi: Oh, okay. I'm surprised this has even gone through Sue, this role, you signed this one off. Sounds litigious.

[00:02:42] Adam Cox: You are litigious

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[00:03:08] Kyle Risi: episode three, and episode four.

[00:03:10] Adam Cox: Yeah. There's a whole bunch.

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[00:03:25] Adam Cox: Yeah. Why wouldn't you want that?

[00:03:27] Kyle Risi: Yeah, we could see we kept a classic this week.

[00:03:29] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

And lastly, guys, please follow us on your favourite app and leave us a review. Your support helps others find us and keeps these amazing stories coming.

[00:03:37] Kyle Risi: Enough of the housekeeping, Adam, because today on the compendium, we are diving into an assembly of online belonging, misplaced confidence, and a plan held together almost entirely by vibes.

[00:03:51] Adam Cox: Okay? You're gonna have to gimme more clues than that.

[00:03:54] Kyle Risi: I've got another clue for you, Adam. What does a cheese sandwich and a ball pit have in common?

[00:04:00] Adam Cox: Hang on, haven't we done? So cheese sandwich was the Fyre Festival, right?

[00:04:04] Kyle Risi: Mm-hmm.

[00:04:05] Adam Cox: So the ball pit, well, I dunno about this festival.

[00:04:07] Kyle Risi: Yeah. But it does give us a very good clue because they both represent, and I'm sure there are more than two of these, but two of pop culture's biggest failures with the most hilarious consequences.

As you said, we covered five festival, the brainchild of Billy McFarland, who set out to create this luxury festival on a Bohemian kind of island once owned by Pablo Escobar. Do you remember that? But did he actually own it? No, he didn't.

[00:04:32] Adam Cox: That's what I thought.

[00:04:33] Kyle Risi: Well, that's part of the scam, right?

[00:04:34] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:04:35] Kyle Risi: Only Billy had never organised a festival before, let alone in another country, with only eight months to go.

And so the writing of course, was firmly on the wall because what ensued was a shit show of epic proportions.

Everything went wrong to the point that one of their senior organisers was literally willing to suck a dick to get customs to release the much needed Evon water for the festival.

[00:04:59] Adam Cox: Yes. That was pretty bad.

[00:05:00] Kyle Risi: Yeah. He took on for the team, eh?

[00:05:02] Adam Cox: Was It's going to. Yeah.

[00:05:03] Kyle Risi: But I mean, he was willing to, he went home, he brushed his teeth, he took a shower. I don't why you need to take a shower for a blowjob, but he wanted to feel pretty, you know? I mean, all that matters in that moment is whether or not you've got a pretty mouth.

[00:05:18] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:05:19] Kyle Risi: And then as everything was collapsing around them, a kid with just a few hundred followers on Twitter, posted a single picture of a sad cheese sandwich in a pot of Irene container, a meal that was supposed to be prepared by one of the finest Michelin star chefs on the planet.

And in the process, that kid single-handedly destroyed a multimillion dollar brand. that was Fyre Festival.

[00:05:41] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:05:41] Kyle Risi: Epic story. Yes. If you haven't listened to it, I'd. I definitely recommend going to it.

[00:05:44] Adam Cox: So it feels like whatever we're covering today is on that level.

[00:05:48] Kyle Risi: Oh yes, of course. Yes. So that brings us to our ball pits because in a very similar fashion, this became a symbol of a shit show that became known as something called DashCon 2014.

Have you heard of that before?

[00:05:58] Adam Cox: No.

[00:05:59] Kyle Risi: So Adam, today we're actually travelling back to the days when Tumblr was the place the Internet's went to find community and belonging.

Did you ever use Tumblr?

[00:06:08] Adam Cox: Vaguely.

I didn't really use it But I knew it was out there.

[00:06:11] Kyle Risi: So as a social platform, Tumblr's heyday was during that period of like the mid 2010s. And today when people look back on Tumblr, they tend to kind of talk about it like it was the social network that just fizzled out once TikTok and Instagram came along and took its place.

But honestly, I don't think those platforms really replaced Tumblr as much as they sort of inherited it. Tumblr's culture, just ended up finding new homes rather than like fizzling out. Do you know what I mean? There's a better platform for this stuff.

Now, don't get me wrong, it's much less concentrated now. It's shinier. It's more commercial, more Gen Z in how it presents itself.

But a huge amount of what Tumblr gave us is still very much alive today in the internet world as we know it. And when I say Tumblr gave us something, I mean that in two ways. On one hand, yes, it gave us all the eye rolling kind of niche nonsense. It's still remembered for like furries,

[00:07:03] Adam Cox: furries.

[00:07:04] Kyle Risi: You dunno what a furry is. No, Adam, you need to be educated. It was just, it's people who walk around like dress as dogs.

[00:07:10] Adam Cox: Oh, hang on a minute. I remember someone at university did little documentary on Furring. It was a fake documentary. But that's where people would dress up in animal costumes

[00:07:18] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[00:07:18] Adam Cox: To get it on.

[00:07:19] Kyle Risi: Exactly. Now they say it's doesn't really have any sexual connotations to it. But I mean, there's certainly a more sexual element to it. When you go to a gay pride, there's always a furry kind of fandom there. And they're normally dressing like furry leathers. Do you know what I mean?

[00:07:33] Adam Cox: People like leather's not great and neither is dressing as fur that's sweaty and hot.

[00:07:37] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[00:07:38] Adam Cox: Not nice.

[00:07:38] Kyle Risi: Yeah. Unless it's like a little crop top, like a little. Furry bra thing.

[00:07:42] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:07:42] Kyle Risi: A little tail. I did see someone, I was driving into work the other day on my bicycle, and I saw a guy, this is eight o'clock in the morning and he was walking from the shop. He was wearing, cowboy boots. Mm-hmm. And he had a furry set of foxy on, and he had a tail on. And it wasn't clear whether or not he was coming home from a night out, like a walk of shame. Mm-hmm. Like a puppy walker shame,

[00:08:02] Adam Cox: or he was on the way to work.

[00:08:04] Kyle Risi: He did look a bit greasy, so it feels like he had a heavy night.

But also it gave us fandoms like the My Little Pony fandom, where you have literally full grown men obsessed with my little pony.

[00:08:16] Adam Cox: Really?

[00:08:17] Kyle Risi: Yeah. Adam. It was also a hotbed where people could make fan fiction. So if you wanted to lean into the fantasy that Harry Potter and Ron Weasley were secret gay lovers, this was the place that you would go to scratch that itch.

[00:08:28] Adam Cox: It feels, I thought it was just like photos that people would share.

[00:08:31] Kyle Risi: It was, but it also contained all of these fandoms that became sort of in the mainstream as the years went on.

[00:08:37] Adam Cox: So it's a little bit like Reddit now, but before Reddit.

[00:08:40] Kyle Risi: But I would say more nerdy, like it was a crucible of nerdom, one giant comic convention of misfit teens looking for community and belonging in a world where they felt like outcasts. and it was Filled with angsty teens, posting poems about their despair and arguing about like the Avengers.

So it was that kind of dynamic like Avengers and, oh my life is shit. That kind of thing. Do you know what I mean? Think emo.

[00:09:03] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:09:03] Kyle Risi: But that version of Tumblr is only part of the story because Adam Tumblr was also a major cultural breeding ground for where a lot of the internet and by extension, a lot of how real life finds its footing today.

And this was a really raw kind of experimental self-expression at the time. It mattered less as a mainstream social network and more as a cultural engine.

Basically it shaped how people talked, how they presented themselves, how they formed their values and their identities today.

A lot of the language we use now around, especially identity, gender, politics, privilege, boundaries, representation, that was all either shaped or amplified on Tumblr.

[00:09:42] Adam Cox: I didn't realise it was such a, yeah. Big deal. I guess I'd already grown up at that point, so maybe I missed Tumblr as a kind of space to connect with other people.

[00:09:51] Kyle Risi: Sure, yeah. Yeah. Fi find your community.

[00:09:53] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:09:54] Kyle Risi: It was definitely a way for people to find their niche communities, but also it's kind of groundbreaking in terms of what it gave us and how transformed kind of the culture when you think about. the LGBTQ plus community, it's very different to what it is today. For a start, we didn't even call it LG BT LGBTQ plus. What did we call it back then?

[00:10:13] Adam Cox: LGB, maybe T.

[00:10:15] Kyle Risi: Yeah, that was like at its progressive peak. Do you know what I mean? Of our time? But queer subculture is a good example of this where every possible intersection now seems to have its own flag, its own vocabulary and a sense of self. Like we like to call it now the alphabet community because of all the letters that have been added.

So officially when we were growing up, was LGBT, but it has since expanded. And do you know what the official seller letters are now?

[00:10:40] Adam Cox: Why is there more than LG BT LGBTQIA plus

[00:10:43] Kyle Risi: it is L-G-B-Q-Q-I-P two SAA

[00:10:48] Adam Cox: and people aren't gonna remember that.

[00:10:51] Kyle Risi: It stands for lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, queer, questioning intersex, pansexual two-spirit androgynous and asexual.

[00:11:01] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:11:01] Kyle Risi: That is of to date.

[00:11:02] Adam Cox: I thought the whole plus was, you know,

[00:11:05] Kyle Risi: encompassing. I think it is. Yes, exactly. We add the plus to say we recognise the others.

We don't need to say it.

[00:11:11] Adam Cox: It's like add cubed onto that or squared.

[00:11:14] Kyle Risi: Yeah. And as you probably remember, it's also where the world introduced us to the 600 pronouns that we have today.

[00:11:21] Adam Cox: Yes. But how many are actually active?

[00:11:23] Kyle Risi: Exactly, yes. But it was at this point, especially during like 2016 when this really blew up in the mainstream and every kind of news channel was talking about and how ridiculous it was at the time.

[00:11:33] Adam Cox: There was one about like and jelly gender where you thought you were an angel. Yeah. Or identified as an angel. Sorry,

[00:11:39] Kyle Risi: I think you have your own pronoun. There was one at the very top of the list. 'cause I only looked at the first five. Adam was one of them. Adam Adam's gender.

[00:11:45] Adam Cox: Yeah. I created that.

[00:11:49] Kyle Risi: And listen, whether or not you agree with it or not, it's kind of beside the point because these ideas are now very much embedded in our culture, whether or not they've been muted or even amplified even more since then.

It doesn't matter. This is where it found its inception. They've spilled out far beyond Tumblr itself and into every other platform and from there into our workplaces, schools, media, entertainment, and everyday life.

So even if Tumblr as a website no longer dominates the conversation, the culture that it produced Absolutely does.

But for all of that, on a more personal level, for the people who use Tumblr, it gave millions of people who felt weird, displaced, isolated, or like nobody in real life quite understood them. A place to find your people, essentially. Try out a new identity, test out who you are, and maybe just feel a little bit less alone.

[00:12:39] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:12:39] Kyle Risi: And I think that more than anything, this is why it mattered. And so it was out of this, that a small group of 20 somethings thought to themselves, wouldn't it be great if instead of hanging out virtually, we could meet up in real life?

[00:12:55] Adam Cox: Ah, so they're the people that organised DashCon?

[00:12:58] Kyle Risi: Yes. And so Adam DashCon was born, which for all intents and purposes, was basically a Tumblr convention.

[00:13:05] Adam Cox: And when you say DashCon, are we talking about DASH or lateral sign? Yes. Dash?

[00:13:11] Kyle Risi: No, A DashCon as in a dashboard.

[00:13:13] Adam Cox: Oh,

[00:13:14] Kyle Risi: and I'm gonna get onto it in a moment because it didn't start out as DashCon.

[00:13:17] Adam Cox: It's not the greatest name.

[00:13:18] Kyle Risi: actually, it's a very clever name.

[00:13:19] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:13:20] Kyle Risi: But the idea was that these popular fringe fandoms would all come together under one roof. So a lot of different identities, different values, different outlooks, different sexual tastes, all under one roof.

They would basically host a bunch of different panels. There would be Cosplaying Tumblr members would host booths to sell and share creative works and homemade merchandise. There would be video games. There'd be live readings and even performances from big, popular, very online bands.

And on top of it all, Adam, they would host a giant ball pit, which sounded legendary.

[00:13:53] Adam Cox: How big is this ball pit?

[00:13:54] Kyle Risi: Big. According to the inception plants.

[00:13:58] Adam Cox: Is that really gonna entertain people a ball pit? Well, we were just in a ball pit. It entertained us for about three minutes.

[00:14:05] Kyle Risi: I couldn't stand, I couldn't even walk. it's not that great.

[00:14:08] Adam Cox: Yeah. Like you go down a slide, you land in it. And you try and stand up and you make your way out really awkward. I don't know how that can be such a big attraction.

[00:14:16] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[00:14:16] Adam Cox: But they were banking on this to bring the crowds.

[00:14:19] Kyle Risi: I think it was a bunch of people who'd never been in a ball pit before and the like. That sounds epic.

[00:14:23] Adam Cox: Did they not go to a birthday party?

[00:14:24] Kyle Risi: Listen, Adam, we are in our mid thirties. Mm-hmm. And we've never been in a ball pit until last week.

[00:14:30] Adam Cox: No, I've been in a ball pit before.

[00:14:31] Kyle Risi: Oh, have? Yeah.

[00:14:32] Adam Cox: Yeah. A kids party.

[00:14:34] Kyle Risi: I've never been invited for this reason. But Adam, just like FY Festival, this small group of 20 somethings who decided to make DashConna reality quickly found themselves well in over their heads. None of them had ever organised a birthday party, let alone a convention for 7,000 people.

[00:14:51] Adam Cox: And so I guess it's, it's fair to say this didn't go to plan, right?

[00:14:55] Kyle Risi: No. This shit well and truly hit the fan.

[00:14:57] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:14:58] Kyle Risi: So Adam, today in the convention, i'm gonna tell you the story of DashCon 2014, the Tumblr Convention that tried to bring the internet into IRL. You like my internet lingo there

[00:15:06] Adam Cox: in real life, yeah.

[00:15:07] Kyle Risi: Right? Yes. But ended up becoming one of the most infamous event disasters of our modern age. And I know I have referenced DashCon alongside Fyre Festival, and many people online have also drawn that comparison. But honestly, DashCon is was far less nefarious than Fyre Festival.

[00:15:26] Adam Cox: Yeah, Fyre Festival was a scam.

[00:15:28] Kyle Risi: Yes. This was just, I think honestly, they had good intentions, but I mean, some people have gone down the rabbit hole. They have looked into these organisers a bit more and they have found some questionable things.

So we can decide whether or not this belongs in the scam column, or maybe an unfortunate set of circumstances.

[00:15:45] Adam Cox: Okay. So how does it all begin?

[00:15:47] Kyle Risi: So I'm not gonna go through the history of Tumblr. I think it's recent enough in our timeline that people sort of know what Tumblr is. If you understand what a meme is, you understand what a furry is, which many of you should. Now, thanks to Adam's explanation, I think you have a pretty good grasp of what Tumblr is.

This isn't a history lesson. We're just here for the drama.

[00:16:05] Adam Cox: So memes and furries. Got it.

[00:16:07] Kyle Risi: Memes and furries. Yes.

So, Adam, it all started back in the early 2010s. When? 17-year-old. Lachlan O'Neill. What a great name. Eh? Is he

[00:16:15] Adam Cox: Scottish?

[00:16:16] Kyle Risi: No, it's a girl for a start.

[00:16:17] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:16:17] Kyle Risi: Lachlan joined Tumblr as one of those misfits of her generation, and very quickly an entire world opened up for her. Lachlan joined a bunch of communities. She was very keen to start experimenting with her identity. She gets involved in a bit of cosplay and a bit of anime and as well as that, she gets sucked into all the arguments that were happening around Avengers at the time. Apparently it was a very popular subject.

[00:16:38] Adam Cox: What kind of arguments?

[00:16:40] Kyle Risi: I dunno, no idea.

[00:16:42] Adam Cox: The arguments of 2011 on Tumblr.

[00:16:44] Kyle Risi: I think the Avengers, did they not do the whole kind of like multiverse timeline splitting and like characters have been brought back and they died long ago and people were really angry about that.

[00:16:53] Adam Cox: They hadn't even started there at that point.

[00:16:54] Kyle Risi: Oh, had they not?

No. Okay. Well then, I don't know. And so of course as it happens with a lot of these online communities, Lachlan decides to bring some of her IRL interests into her kind of online world, specifically her enthusiasm for small animal husbandry.

What do you think that is?

[00:17:11] Adam Cox: Small animal husbandry. Um, taking an animal and saying it's your husband

[00:17:16] Kyle Risi: Marrying them.

[00:17:18] Adam Cox: So small animals like Guinea pigs.

[00:17:20] Kyle Risi: Setting them up in a little groom in a bridal outfit and then taking photos, selling them.

[00:17:24] Adam Cox: This is Dave my other half,

[00:17:27] Kyle Risi: Basically she was really into rats and rabbits,

[00:17:30] Adam Cox: Uhhuh.

So I wasn't actually wrong.

[00:17:31] Kyle Risi: Not, not quite. You we're a million miles off. But she's not marrying them,

[00:17:35] Adam Cox: right? Why husbandry?

[00:17:36] Kyle Risi: I think it's because husbandry is like what you call like rearing cattle.

[00:17:40] Adam Cox: English language is so confusing at times.

[00:17:43] Kyle Risi: Anyway, Adam,

she starts a little blog that she calls my son. Nice. She's good.

[00:17:52] Adam Cox: I wonder how long that took her to think of that.

[00:17:55] Kyle Risi: Her thinking is that there must be other people out there with an interest in mice.

[00:17:59] Adam Cox: I think they're nice.

[00:18:00] Kyle Risi: Yeah. And then they think they're nice and she's absolutely right. It's very popular. She talked about mouse genetics, and breeding. The followers posted pictures of their own mice and their own mice stories. And a lot of lachlan's socialisation was becoming increasing more and more online because she'd finally found where she felt like she belonged.

Mm-hmm.

And at the time, this isn't something that she really recognised as an issue. And so one day she was searching for content about her hometown where she ended up connecting with a girl local to the area. And for the very first time in her life, Lachlan felt like she had met her BFF.

[00:18:37] Adam Cox: Ah.

[00:18:38] Kyle Risi: So it's really sweet, right?

[00:18:39] Adam Cox: Yeah.

[00:18:39] Kyle Risi: But this opens Lachlan's eyes up a little bit. She thought to herself, if I've managed to bridge that gap. From connections in her virtual playground into real life, maybe others could perhaps do the same.

And so on. Her blog, Lachlan uses, what if Adam, there was a Tumblr convention where people could meet up with all their online friends, her post gets a tonne of attention, but what she doesn't realise is that this post that she makes wasn't actually a new and novel idea.

Her post was only building upon ideas that were already floating around a Tumblr at the time.

People were already fascinated by this idea of what it would be like if Tumblr was like a school where they all went together. And so like in these threads, people would like post mockups of what the Tumblr school dorms would look like.

Like what the uniforms would consist of, and what they would study. Like things like meme theory or Tumblr etiquette and how to behave on Tumblr.

[00:19:36] Adam Cox: And so are these people, students, they're quite young.

[00:19:40] Kyle Risi: They're teenagers. Yes. They're finding their identity. They're probably relating to the fact that they're still at school.

[00:19:45] Adam Cox: Fine. Because I was gonna say, I do not have time to dream up a school and post online,

[00:19:50] Kyle Risi: but it's been done all collaboratively in these communities, basically.

But also on the curriculum, there'd be things like fandom studies, like deep dives into kind of specific shows like The Avengers or furries books and films. Twilight or whatever was popular at the time.

So it was all just a bit of fun but as well as Tumblr High, they also had Tumblr Island, which we probably shouldn't have venture too deeply into considering the taboos around islands today.

[00:20:15] Adam Cox: Okay, moving on then. Yeah,

[00:20:18] Kyle Risi: and so now Tumblr convention was just another avenue for people to fantasise within. So while these posts were all very much in earnest, there was a degree of sincerity behind them, And so people started to flesh out the idea. Some started volunteering themselves as committee heads of the different fandoms that they would host at the convention.

Do you know like the, I dunno, the Harry Potter stand or the Star Wars stand, or the Star Trek stand, et cetera. Or the

[00:20:41] Adam Cox: cheesecake stand.

[00:20:42] Kyle Risi: The Cheesecake stand, yes.

[00:20:44] Adam Cox: Yeah, I'll go to that one.

[00:20:46] Kyle Risi: It's not really commend. Have you ever been to a convention?

[00:20:48] Adam Cox: Uh, hasn't had a cheesecake stand,

[00:20:51] Kyle Risi: so I didn't Go quick check what they're hosting.

And of course, more independent kind of artists and kind of creators on Tumblr started coming forward saying that they would host booze where they would sell their own artwork and fan fiction. They start talking about special guest speakers that they would invite and all the fun activities that they would host.

[00:21:10] Adam Cox: It sounds Yeah. Very much like Comic Kahan or some kind of Doctor Who convention.

[00:21:14] Kyle Risi: Yeah. If you know what those things are, then this is pretty much it. But for all the different fandoms that you find on Tumblr, and there are many.

[00:21:21] Adam Cox: Yeah. And it also feels a bit more like a, like an art, festival or a bit like latitude where you'd have the poetry tent. You've got a few other things going on. Yes. So it's a bit broader than just like sci-fi.

[00:21:30] Kyle Risi: Exactly, yes. And the idea is to just bring all these people together so they can meet their friends in real life. Mm-hmm. Because these people make real strong connections on Tumblr.

Now, at the time, Lachlan does not take any of this seriously.

She literally says I'm just a teenager. And also Adam, she's only ever been to two conventions in her entire life. The first was like a small anime convention, and I think the other one was on like rabbit breeding.

[00:21:50] Adam Cox: Rabbit breeding.

[00:21:51] Kyle Risi: Yeah. As a convention. A whole convention, yeah. Had a poetry tent. Had a furry tent.

[00:21:56] Adam Cox: Cheesecake stand. Cheesecake

[00:21:57] Kyle Risi: stand.

But around this point, Lachlan is becoming more and more preoccupied with her real life responsibilities, having to move interstate. So she's packing, she's moving furniture, she's disconnecting her water, her gas, and also her wifi.

And so there's a period of time where Lachlan is effectively offline scary thoughts.

[00:22:16] Adam Cox: So is she living by herself then?

[00:22:18] Kyle Risi: I get the sense that maybe she's a young teenager, so I imagine she's probably still living or maybe just getting ready to move away. I'm not sure.

However, Adam is, while she's away that on the 11th of March, three of her followers, Roxanne, Meghan and Kane Hopkins decide enough talk, let's make this shit happen.

They decide the convention will be called Tumblr Con, USA. And so they decide to go off and create an in the Go-Go campaign page.

And basically their goal is to raise $4,000 to just get this idea off the ground. Then to gain momentum they take to their Tumblr page with a post that says,

hosting a convention is not something any of us saw within ourselves. Tumblr Con was just a half shaped idea. We caught a whiff of once in a while when a stray post or two drifted on our dash.

And so breathing new life into this idea has been something that all of our staff members have been working tirelessly on over the last month or so.

She said we hardly remember what our lives were like before. Tumblr, USA really can't remember what our life was 30 days ago,

[00:23:25] Adam Cox: but all she did was put out a post no and set up a GoFundMe page.

[00:23:29] Kyle Risi: They're just drinking wine and kind of brainstorming, but basically it's changed their lives in 30 days.

[00:23:35] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:23:35] Kyle Risi: They go on to say there's only so much passion you can put into starting a business before the real work comes crashing down on your shoulders. Mainly we have to deal with the government and money,

[00:23:47] Adam Cox: right?

[00:23:47] Kyle Risi: They say we can take care of the legal side of things. However, money is not something a group of 20 something year olds have in abundance.

But the legal aspect, they've got that covered.

[00:23:56] Adam Cox: Yeah. What? What are they talking about? I

[00:23:59] Kyle Risi: dunno. They take themselves very seriously.

[00:24:01] Adam Cox: Uhhuh. They just need to hire a venue. Surely that's all they need

[00:24:04] Kyle Risi: to do. Well, they're gonna do that, but they need to do all the paperwork and apply for grants . Basically the post says, this is where you followers can help.

If just a hundred of our nearly 4,000 followers donate just $10, we would have enough to get ourselves off the ground. We would use the money to pay for some software, venue deposits, hire some equipment, file additional paperwork, and apply for more grants on top of the ones that we've already applied for.

In a nutshell, we're in our twenties, please give us your money.

[00:24:29] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:24:29] Kyle Risi: Of course, organising convention doesn't cost $4,000. It's literally upwards Adam of like hundreds of thousands of dollars, even just for like a small convention. So they don't really have a decent grasp of that at this point.

[00:24:42] Adam Cox: Yeah. If they've got no experience of doing this, you're just making it up as you go along.

[00:24:46] Kyle Risi: Exactly. But in the Post, they make no mention of their experience, who else is involved, or what other grants they're actually applying for.

But considering the appetite for the convention based on all the fantasy posts, people didn't really care what people were more excited about was the notion of that this could potentially happen, but also. As a reward for donating Meg Cain and Roxanne promised rewards like business cards with your Tumblr, URL on it.

You would get like gift baskets, t-shirts, acknowledging that you've been instrumental in making Tumblr Con USA reality kind of things like that. Right. And that that really excited people.

[00:25:21] Adam Cox: That sounds great. But I bet they haven't costed or modelled any of this to go like, oh yeah, get a business card, a t-shirt. They worked out how much that's gonna cost.

[00:25:29] Kyle Risi: Exactly. No, it doesn't seem like there's been a huge amount of this, but Adam, almost overnight, they raised the $4,000 that they need, and from there they feel like this is the green light to them, which is like not good.

[00:25:40] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:25:40] Kyle Risi: Or Lachlan, by the way, she has no idea any of this is going on.

[00:25:43] Adam Cox: She's busy playing with her ice.

[00:25:45] Kyle Risi: Yeah. By the way, Lachlan does get involved in the convention, but she doesn't really feature too much in the story. But by far she's considered like the founding face of the convention. But a lot of the shit that goes down is not really down to her. I think she tries her best.

[00:25:57] Adam Cox: Right. So she's brought in later on when she finds out.

[00:26:00] Kyle Risi: Yeah. She logs back online. She's what the fuck?

[00:26:02] Adam Cox: What have I gotta do

[00:26:04] Kyle Risi: so the next step after raising the cash is to become official. Meg Kane and Roxanne, they file to set Tumblr con up as an LLP. It's basically the equivalent of an LTD here in the uk.

this is where they hit their first N because Tumblr like, whoa there, Nelly. You can't just call it Convention Tumblr Con A, we dunno who you are. And B, we are not interested in having our name associated with you people.

[00:26:28] Adam Cox: Yeah, I was gonna say there's a copyright infringement.

[00:26:30] Kyle Risi: Right, exactly. They run into a potential copyright issue. So plan B is to find a new name, which they eventually land on DashCon.

And this is because when you log into Tumblr, you are basically immediately met with the dashboard, which is your main fee that springs you off into the various fandoms that you belong to, which perfectly captures what this convention was all about. This coming together of all these different fandoms in one feed or in under one roof, So it's clever in that sense.

[00:26:57] Adam Cox: It if, yeah. If otherwise to anyone else is that sounds lame.

[00:27:00] Kyle Risi: Yeah. But for the people who are going to this convention, they're in the know.

[00:27:04] Adam Cox: Oh, they'll get it.

Yeah, sure. Yes. So what did actually Tumblr do? 'cause when they found out this was happening, did they not think, oh, there's money to be made here, or this is an opportunity, let's get involved, or either shut that down and we'll do our own thing.

[00:27:15] Kyle Risi: I just don't think that they thought that it would happen. But also they just don't have time for that. I guess they're a software company.

[00:27:21] Adam Cox: True.

[00:27:21] Kyle Risi: So they register their LLP, they then get to brainstorming where they'll host the event. They find this massive convention centre at the Renaissance, I wanna call it Schomburg. It's a convention centre in Illinois.

It's got like 500 rooms over 15 floors. It's got a spa, a pool, but more importantly, atom, it has 160,000 square feet of available convention space. It is fucking huge.

[00:27:47] Adam Cox: I was gonna say that is massive. And I had a thought, do you know what, if you're doing this for the first time mm-hmm. Let's just make sure it happens and it's a success. Yeah. Make it a small event, right? And then build upon that.

[00:27:57] Kyle Risi: Exactly. For a first time convention. This is huge. I heard somewhere like Dragoncon, which is a very famous convention, I believe, I wanna say Atlanta, their very first convention, just 300 people.

[00:28:09] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:28:09] Kyle Risi: Which is smart, right? Mm-hmm.

And now it's one of the biggest conventions in America.

[00:28:12] Adam Cox: Is about dragons.

[00:28:13] Kyle Risi: I have no idea.

[00:28:16] Adam Cox: Yeah. So to go, you've gone straight for a massive convention.

[00:28:21] Kyle Risi: Yes. But in their minds, they probably think 7,000 people's, not that many people. Do you know what I mean?

[00:28:26] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:28:27] Kyle Risi: Considering how much time they've got to plan.

[00:28:28] Adam Cox: Yeah.

[00:28:29] Kyle Risi: And so. This hotel is huge. The hotel, however, asks very few questions. All they wanna know is how many people when and how they're gonna bloody pay for this thing.

And at this point they have no idea of how many tickets they can feasibly sell. And so this is where out of thin air, they tell the hotel We expect 7,000 guests.

[00:28:48] Adam Cox: Right. Did the hotel go and Can I speak to your parents please?

[00:28:52] Kyle Risi: No. This is the thing, they're in their twenties, almost thirties. So they seem like adults. I think it's only Roxanne who's 19 years old.

[00:28:59] Adam Cox: Oh, okay, fine.

[00:29:00] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

But the point is, logistically the 7,000 guest number is essentially made up. The agreement that they come up with the hotel is that after the event, the money that they generate from ticket sales and walk-ins will go to effectively pay for the hotel and the convention space and stuff.

Next the hotel wanna know when are you planning on hosting this convention? And so on the spot, they effectively settle for the weekend of the 11th to the 13th of July, 2014.

[00:29:27] Adam Cox: And how far away is that from this point?

[00:29:29] Kyle Risi: 16 months.

[00:29:30] Adam Cox: 16 months, okay. So they've given themselves a fair amount of time.

[00:29:32] Kyle Risi: Yeah, it's, no, it's a decent amount of time, isn't it? Mm-hmm. Sounds like a lot. Although Meg for sure, she has a full-time job, Adam, and I'm not sure where she's gonna get all the time that she's gonna need. 16 months sounds a lot, but she's working a full-time job.

[00:29:46] Adam Cox: Yeah. And if it's just these three people that are organising it, that's a lot for three people. I'm talking about 16 months when you have a full team.

[00:29:51] Kyle Risi: Yeah. And Roxanne isn't 19,

[00:29:53] Adam Cox: she doesn't know what she's doing.

[00:29:54] Kyle Risi: And Kas a man, we need Meg.

So following this, they begin working out how they're gonna fund everything and what that money will physically get them in terms of special guests panels and convention features.

They calculate that a regular weekend pass will cost cost $65 more if you want to attend any of the additional special events that they might host.

They work out that if they sell 7,000 tickets, this will net them $500,000, which isn't a lot of money. Right. For $65.

[00:30:20] Adam Cox: The amount of effort that you have to put into this. Yeah. Because then you need to then hire a load of like acts and things like that. Yes. You can probably make money off merchandise.

[00:30:27] Kyle Risi: Sure.

[00:30:28] Adam Cox: Charge a fee or whatever it is.

[00:30:29] Kyle Risi: But straight away, let's assume you would expect if you were pouring in 16 months of work at a full-time basis, right?

[00:30:36] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:30:36] Kyle Risi: Meg, Roxanne, and Kane, they probably would like a salary, right? So let's just say they, you pay 'em $50,000 each, That's $150 gone already. It's not a lot.

[00:30:45] Adam Cox: And you've got like renting the whole the food, all sorts.

[00:30:48] Kyle Risi: You've gotta pay for your special guests,

So on top of ticket sales, they will also be renting out booths to merchants and independent artists to sell commissions, fan art, fanfiction, all sorts of those types of things. But as well as me, CA and Roxanne trying to raise money through ticket sales, they also have different committee members also helping to raise money too.

So for example, the Star Trek committee, they agree that they will split all of their sales 60 40, so 60%, of the money being raised, going to the convention. And then the other 40% will go to them to help them get to the convention and things like that.

So they've got money being raised all over the place. So it's not just this $500,000 that they're, they're relying on. It's also, of course, the additional ticket sales for the special events. They've got these committees raising money and they've got the sales from the booths that they're renting out, which is $150 a pop.

[00:31:32] Adam Cox: Okay. So it feels like it's coming together, but it still doesn't feel clear to me that they've really worked out like the profitability of this.

[00:31:38] Kyle Risi: So eventually they start working out who their headliners are gonna be. They do manage to secure a robot steam punk band called Steam Power Giraffe to perform a concert. Have you ever heard of them?

[00:31:49] Adam Cox: Have I ever heard of them?

[00:31:51] Kyle Risi: It's a legitimate question.

[00:31:53] Adam Cox: Steve Punk. Who now?

[00:31:55] Kyle Risi: Steam punk. Steam powered giraffe Adam.

[00:32:00] Adam Cox: Steam powered giraffe. Okay,

[00:32:01] Kyle Risi: so you've not heard of them?

[00:32:03] Adam Cox: No. They're my favourites on my Apple podcast. Yeah.

[00:32:05] Kyle Risi: Apparently they're pretty big on the Tumblr community, but they're also very pricey.

So if you are gonna be attending and you wanna see them, this is gonna cost you an additional $5 to see them, which Adam is not a lot of extra money, right? Mm-hmm. $5.

are expecting some walk-ins as well. And so if you come and you only wanna see, steam power giraffe, then it will cost you $25 at the door. But again, it just doesn't feel like a lot.

They also managed to secure, welcome to Night Veil. Have you heard of them before?

[00:32:32] Adam Cox: No.

[00:32:33] Kyle Risi: So they're a popular podcast in the style of a weird small town community radio show sort of thing. It's very popular. They manage to book them for a live show and are considered sort of the headliner along with, steam power giraffe.

And welcome to the Nightvale. They'll often do live shows, but they always sell out really fast because of how popular there are. So for many people coming to this convention, they're coming to this convention specifically. To see Welcome to the Night Fail.

[00:32:58] Adam Cox: Okay. All right. A couple of good acts. Yes. If you are within the Tumblr community

[00:33:02] Kyle Risi: Exactly.

But also to bring a degree of legitimacy to the convention. They also join up in partnership with a charity called Random Acts dedicated to inspiring and funding various acts of kindness around the world.

So it looks good to have them as a partner. On the website, they also secure special guests like, uh, Doug Jones, who famously played Fawn in Pam's Labyrinth, but also Abe Sapien in Hellboy.

[00:33:26] Adam Cox: Yes.

[00:33:27] Kyle Risi: And the Amphibian man in Shape of Water.

[00:33:30] Adam Cox: Oh, okay. So all the same

[00:33:31] Kyle Risi: guy.

[00:33:32] Adam Cox: Yeah. Because he's like a movement special art

[00:33:35] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[00:33:35] Adam Cox: Person,

[00:33:36] Kyle Risi: isn't he? Yeah, he's very good at that. So he is very famous for playing these really obscure fantasy characters.

[00:33:40] Adam Cox: So actually this does sound much more reputable than I thought it was

[00:33:44] Kyle Risi: gonna be.

Oh yeah. They've got some big people here. Doug Jones will also be doing like a q and a panel, plus he'll be doing like meet and greets with fans and things like that. Mm-hmm. So it's a big deal.

Of course, it is a convention, so they'll also be hosting various panels too.

If you've ever been to a convention before. A panel is like this live discussion session where experts or fans talk about a topic like TV shows, comics, or different fandoms.

It's held in a room with like seats for attendees usually last like 45 to 90 minutes. And so if you wanted to be a panellist at DashCon 2014, Meg Kane and Roxanne Adam, they don't make it easy they take the selection process far too seriously, which just ends up wasting so much unnecessary time.

It's sometimes too difficult for panellists to get through.

And so before they even get to the final interview, they're like, you know what, this is bullshit. And they pull out and they're like, they no, come back, come back, come back. they're just doing, it's because they think that's how you arrange a panel.

The first thing is that they wanna make sure that everyone is thoroughly vetted on their subject matter across like as many as six Skype calls.

So you'll be like hosting a panel on like BDSM for example, which was an actual panel that they hosted.

[00:34:51] Adam Cox: BDSM is

[00:34:52] Kyle Risi: like sexual fetish stuff.

[00:34:53] Adam Cox: That's what I thought. Yeah.

[00:34:55] Kyle Risi: Yes. And so they're like on these calls, so, um. What's your expertise? And they're like, well, I studied BDSM at Cornell for like three years, and I have a chain of brothels. And they're like, Hmm, I'm not sure what else.

Well, I like to stuff butt plugs up my butt. And they're like, wow, he's good. You're in.

[00:35:14] Adam Cox: Really? There's someone that you could study this?

[00:35:17] Kyle Risi: Yes, Adam. Yes.

[00:35:21] Adam Cox: I generally thought

[00:35:22] Kyle Risi: that have a masters hip, but plug, um, in autonomy.

[00:35:26] Adam Cox: I I thought this was a general, a genuine panel.

[00:35:29] Kyle Risi: No, but this is the thing that they make it really difficult. They like, they want to make sure that you know your shit, but it's just like over six Skype calls. Come on.

[00:35:36] Adam Cox: Yeah.

[00:35:36] Kyle Risi: Like it's just a plug in your butt and you go. but also on the BDSM panel, remember many of these guests, they're miners and so they're hosting an R rated panel. I dunno how they're gonna vet who's underage.

[00:35:48] Adam Cox: Yeah. Why would you have like a, that kind of panel? It's to, especially if you've got a lot of teenage audience.

[00:35:53] Kyle Risi: Mm-hmm.

[00:35:53] Adam Cox: You wanna sell as many tickets, you probably wanna make this PG 12. Yeah. Or whatever.

[00:35:58] Kyle Risi: It's, it's mental. Some of the other panels that they secure is like an ex forensic guy who throughout his career has seen Adam some horrific things like murders, car accidents, people being crushed in machinery, all sorts of stuff. His panel is basically to teach you how to realistically incorporate really horrific things into your fan fiction.

[00:36:20] Adam Cox: What?

[00:36:20] Kyle Risi: Yeah, like what would happen if your body was hit by a car travelling a hundred miles an hour? What would it realistically look like? And he was there to basically show you photographs and to help you describe what this would look like or sound like in your fan fiction.

[00:36:34] Adam Cox: I just feel like that's a bit weird to do in an open forum.

[00:36:38] Kyle Risi: it's grim. And these are kids.

But as well as their expertise in the field, they also vetted on their leadership ability and their public speaking skills. But Adam, for all that time wasted, none of this mattered because the most important thing for these three was how many people these panellists might be able to attract to the convention.

So like you pass through all this vetting process, you prove that you're really knowledgeable on your subjects, bring real value to the convention. And in the end, the deciding factories.

How many people can you bring to the, uh, to the convention?

[00:37:10] Adam Cox: Yeah. Surely that's where you start, right? Like, look at all of their following or whatever it is. Pick the top 10.

Then work out what they're good at. Public speaking. There you go. Done.

[00:37:19] Kyle Risi: Yeah. And basically they're offered incentive structure. If you manage to attract more than 50 attendees across your two panels, you would get a percentage off your ticket full a day. If you attract more than a hundred attendees, you would get your entire ticket comped off

but the thing that, that's not really how, these panels even works in the first place. It detracts from their credibility, right? Yeah. That they're just looking how many people can you get to the convention rather than you can add real value or people will love you.

[00:37:43] Adam Cox: I don't know. They've gotta obviously get fans there. .

[00:37:45] Kyle Risi: focus on your marketing. That's what your marketing's for, right?

[00:37:47] Adam Cox: Yeah, true. true.

[00:37:47] Kyle Risi: So eventually they have decided on all their different events that they're gonna be hosting, and they decide to post the schedule up on their website on Tumblr.

Bear in mind, Adam, it's still very early days, and so them posting this up, this is like them posting up the official lineup, act like they're 16 months out, like things change massively. People will drop out, right? Mm-hmm. That naturally happens.

Either way. Tumblr gets very excited.

[00:38:11] Adam Cox: When you say Tumblr get excited, do you mean the people on Tumblr, not Tumblr itself?

[00:38:16] Kyle Risi: Yeah. The people on Tumblr. They're followers. The people dead keen on making this happen.

[00:38:21] Adam Cox: Sure.

[00:38:21] Kyle Risi: Panellists include a day in the life of Hogwarts, exploring the Omega verse, which is this weird erotic fan fiction, which is seems to be a lot of fan fiction. They also had, um, Oscar Troll, which will be, hosted by Locklin as a panellist.

[00:38:36] Adam Cox: So does, does she know that she's doing this?

[00:38:38] Kyle Risi: Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's involved, but she's not running the show

[00:38:41] Adam Cox: essentially. Okay. So she is what a troll herself.

[00:38:44] Kyle Risi: I, I, I don't know.

[00:38:45] Adam Cox: And is troll another word for something else?

[00:38:48] Kyle Risi: I don't know. It might be like how to like. Ask a troll, like online trolling, because the next one is, a panel on how to deal with bullies.

[00:38:59] Adam Cox: So not trolls that live under a bridge.

[00:39:01] Kyle Risi: It genuinely could be

[00:39:02] Adam Cox: okay.

[00:39:03] Kyle Risi: I dunno.

Finally, my favourite panel was, you ready for this?

[00:39:07] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:39:07] Kyle Risi: British Men with cheekbones, adam Tumblr go nuts when they see this lineup act.

[00:39:19] Adam Cox: Hang on. No, I'm not done

[00:39:20] Kyle Risi: about that. Oh, we need to go back. Okay.

[00:39:22] Adam Cox: I'm not done

[00:39:22] Kyle Risi: with moving back to men with cheekbones.

[00:39:24] Adam Cox: So what will happen at this specific event?

[00:39:27] Kyle Risi: Um, okay. I don't know

[00:39:31] Adam Cox: how. Yeah. How did you not find out about this one in particular? I wanna know about, do we look at the fact that British men are not known for having cheekbones?

So have they all got like little paddleboards? They show pictures of a British actor or cheekbones and they'll go, oh yeah, it's an eight outta 10.

[00:39:44] Kyle Risi: Uh, I don't know. There's a lot of, I don't know. I'm sorry.

[00:39:49] Adam Cox: Are they just like looking at, I just, now I want to go, I want to go to this. It seems ridiculous.

[00:39:58] Kyle Risi: Anyway, Adam Tumblr go nuts. There's genuine buzz that all this is actually happening now within the online fury around all of this. One of the kids in the comments asks how he's going to convince his parents to let him drive to a whole different state, to meet a bunch of strangers on the internet that he's never met before.

And so to help him out, Roxanne, Meg and Cain, they respond with a PowerPoint presentation,

[00:40:22] Adam Cox: like a little, how to guide, how to educate your parents that you're not off to be killed.

[00:40:26] Kyle Risi: They respond with a PowerPoint presentation written in comic sands. Of course. 'cause there's the internet that includes slides about how nice the hotel was, slides about all the different events and panels, including British men were cheekbones.

And a suggestion that the kid put a lot of emphasis on the convention star attraction, the giant ball pit. And there is an entire slide featuring a massive giant inflatable WARPit

[00:40:53] Adam Cox: and that's gonna convince his parents to let him go drive across state to go jump in a giant pool pit

[00:40:59] Kyle Risi: essentially.

That's what they're saying. Yes. Adam, this PowerPoint goes up on the 22nd of July, 2013. It goes fucking viral. And this is the thing that everyone bases their expectations on what this convention is going to be.

[00:41:14] Adam Cox: I mean, it sounds good. How big is the ball pit?

[00:41:16] Kyle Risi: We'll keep moving forward.

[00:41:18] Adam Cox: You don't know.

[00:41:19] Kyle Risi: I do know.

[00:41:20] Adam Cox: Okay.

Like

[00:41:23] Kyle Risi: is this the image on the PowerPoint presentation? Adam is this huge inflatable jungle gym ball pit.

[00:41:30] Adam Cox: And so where they've just got that picture from online?

[00:41:32] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[00:41:32] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:41:33] Kyle Risi: So basically there's a whole year where that ball pit is instrumental in hyping up what this commission is going to be.

But either way, things are progressing. But here's another snag. Roxanne Cain and Meghan, they are quite literally overwhelmed to the point that they start to realise that they don't have enough marketing reach or sheer manpower to handle 7,000 guests at the convention.

[00:41:52] Adam Cox: Yeah. What about the staff to manage these people's security, whatever.

[00:41:56] Kyle Risi: Exactly. So, I dunno, Maybe it was a night of them drinking, smoking a bit of dub. Who knows? They decided to make a key decision where they were cap ticket sales to around 1,500 for the whole weekend, leaving a bit of extra room for walk-ins, which they're optimistically assume will come in large numbers.

The problem is that decision never rolls up into the wider budget and everything that they've already planned and secured, including the hotel who expect to be paid from the ticket money that the DashCon brings.

[00:42:27] Adam Cox: The 7,000 people. Yeah.

[00:42:28] Kyle Risi: Yeah. Adam, they just ignore this.

They're like, yeah. Yeah. This will make our lives easier by capping attendees. Roxanne is like, and this is shocking, coming from Roxanne, she's 19, remember? She's like, but what about everything else we've committed to? And Megan Cain are like.

What are you getting at Roxanne?

[00:42:43] Adam Cox: I think it's not shocking. Someone that actually has half a clue just pointing out. But

[00:42:48] Kyle Risi: she's the youngest one is my point.

[00:42:49] Adam Cox: Yeah, it doesn't matter about age, just someone that's a raising this.

[00:42:52] Kyle Risi: Yeah, it's mental. But also that leads us onto who will run the entire thing. Because as you mentioned, they need staff, right?

[00:42:58] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:42:59] Kyle Risi: And so with the reduced ticket sales, they don't really have that much money for staff and anything else. So what they do is the next best option, all the staff will be volunteers.

[00:43:07] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:43:08] Kyle Risi: And as a volunteer, Adam, what will convince you to, volunteer your time.

[00:43:12] Adam Cox: I guess. One you get to go free.

[00:43:15] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[00:43:15] Adam Cox: So you have to do a shift work probably. Mm-hmm. And then the rest of you, you're allowed to enjoy the experience.

[00:43:20] Kyle Risi: What's an acceptable shift length to get your ticket for free?

[00:43:23] Adam Cox: Maybe like a day.

[00:43:24] Kyle Risi: Okay, so you like work on the Friday, but you've got the Saturday and the Sunday free,

[00:43:28] Adam Cox: something like that?

Yeah.

[00:43:29] Kyle Risi: Okay.

So they are basically relying on the fact that volunteers love the idea of DashCon so much they'd be willing to just do about anything to attend.

If you volunteer to work between one and 11 hours as a volunteer, you will receive. Undying gratitude.

[00:43:47] Adam Cox: Okay,

[00:43:48] Kyle Risi: so nothing, basically.

If you volunteer between 12 and 90 hours, you would receive a refund off your badge cost, which

is

[00:43:55] Kyle Risi: what you said.

[00:43:56] Adam Cox: So you have to pay for your badge.

[00:43:57] Kyle Risi: You have to pay for your badge initially. Yes. You'll get the refund later on.

[00:44:00] Adam Cox: No, that's not part of the deal.

[00:44:01] Kyle Risi: If you volunteered for over 20 hours, not only would you get a refund off your ticket, but you would also get, uh, your hotel room refunded for the Friday and Saturday night.

[00:44:10] Adam Cox: No, I don't wanna refund it.

[00:44:11] Kyle Risi: You don't wanna have to go through the rig world refunding, right.

[00:44:13] Adam Cox: I want it prepaid.

[00:44:14] Kyle Risi: Exactly. And so online, DashCon is literally everything that people are talking about. And this is the key thing to remember. Online conversation and hype is not the same as real life hype and excitement.

[00:44:28] Adam Cox: I know. 'cause you've got all these people going, yeah, it's great. I'm gonna go. And they're all get to the day and it's Ugh, I can't bothered.

[00:44:32] Kyle Risi: that's it. Or no, I'm not gonna buy a ticket. Will that hype translate into attendees? Especially if it means having to travel to a whole nother state to attend. Do you know what I mean? Mm-hmm. Because remember, this isn't just online community in Illinois. This is people spread across the whole world. They've got like 4,000 followers, right?

[00:44:48] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:44:48] Kyle Risi: That's 4,000 followers across the whole world.

[00:44:50] Adam Cox: Oh. Oh yeah, this is gonna be a shit show.

[00:44:53] Kyle Risi: Yeah. But for Meg Cain and Roxanne, to them, this convention is going to be huge, which only convinces them more of this with every single post and comment that gets posted subsequently.

[00:45:02] Adam Cox: So they've kind of bought into their own kind of echo chamber that they've created.

[00:45:05] Kyle Risi: Yeah, that's it. It's sad.

Probably the funniest post that I came across was when someone asked, and this was said very earnestly and sincerely.

Someone asked what would be the dress code for DashCon? And the official response from the organisers was, the dress code is only this, no t-shirts, no shorts, no sneakers, no jeans.

Adam,

[00:45:26] Adam Cox: what are you supposed to wear?

[00:45:27] Kyle Risi: Exactly. This is a convention. If you've ever been to a convention, you know that the uniform is essentially t-shirts with weird motifs on it.

[00:45:35] Adam Cox: Uhhuh

[00:45:36] Kyle Risi: Cargo shorts and sneakers and trainers.

[00:45:38] Adam Cox: So it was it a joke?

[00:45:40] Kyle Risi: I have no idea. I think what they're trying to do is maybe encourage people to cosplay.

[00:45:44] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:45:45] Kyle Risi: I don't know.

[00:45:46] Adam Cox: Why didn't they just say that?

[00:45:47] Kyle Risi: Why didn't they just say that? It's weird.

But it could also be seriously that they're expecting this to be like, this is a decent hotel. We want everyone in Chinos and casual shirts

[00:45:56] Adam Cox: that or I read into it. Don't wear anything.

[00:45:59] Kyle Risi: Oh, I mean I didn't finish the line, but it did say no sneakers, no jeans, everything else is up to you.

[00:46:06] Adam Cox: There we see. There we go. Yeah, they're

[00:46:08] Kyle Risi: not

[00:46:08] Adam Cox: ruling it out

[00:46:09] Kyle Risi: and they are hosting a panel on BDSM.

[00:46:11] Adam Cox: That's still weird.

[00:46:12] Kyle Risi: So you can see the butt plug poking out.

[00:46:14] Adam Cox: Oh,

[00:46:14] Kyle Risi: the ferric event will have one of those butt plugs with the tail on the end moving on.

So I appreciate at this point, and maybe I've left it a little bit too late to mention that behind the scenes things are not as rosy as they appear to be on Tumblr because Meg, Roxanne and Kane Adam, they are not getting on and they've not been getting on since the very beginning.

In the organising of this, it's basically Roxanne's job to plan and organise what they call the artist alley. This is the booths of independent creators looking to sell their artwork, merch and kind of fan fiction.

Meg is going to be the primary contact for all the guests in the panellists a big responsibility. You would think that that job would go to Meg because she's like. 30. She's a career woman. She seems the most responsible, right? It's a big thing.

[00:47:01] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:47:02] Kyle Risi: It's a crucial role. You could say without Meg, there is no convention, right?

[00:47:07] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:47:07] Kyle Risi: Cain on the other hand, he's responsible for handing all the legal stuff that means contracts, lawyers, insurance, you name it.

Problem is Megan Kane. They're not doing anything

[00:47:18] Adam Cox: really.

[00:47:18] Kyle Risi: It's so bad. They just cannot be bothered. All the heavy lifting falls on. Roxanne, who remember is 19 years old. Megan's 30, Cain is 28 and so all the heavy lifting falls on Roxanne.

She is apparently forced to stay up until 2:00 AM most nights, answering questions from guests and panellists that Meg was literally just ignoring.

[00:47:40] Adam Cox: Then why is she just, you know what, I'm gonna call this quits. Why? Why is she wants to

[00:47:44] Kyle Risi: make it happen? I guess

[00:47:45] Adam Cox: why? Why is none of them calling this quits? Yeah, clearly they're in over the heads

[00:47:48] Kyle Risi: so bad. Cain, he basically eventually stops answering all emails from the lawyers, which results in the lawyers quitting, leaving DashCon loyalists weeks go by and Kane doesn't know the lawyer has pulled out.

[00:48:02] Adam Cox: Really?

[00:48:03] Kyle Risi: Yeah. That's how badly he's neglecting his emails.

[00:48:06] Adam Cox: But why? What's his reason? He just couldn't be bothered.

[00:48:08] Kyle Risi: I think they're just stoned all the time. I don't know. I dunno what it is. Kane and Meg, they also start using their official DashCon phones for personal calls. Adam. They managed to somehow rack up massive phone bills, which they don't have enough money in the kitty to physically pay for because it's all earmarked for other things. Remember, they've also capped the tickets now. So all that money's already been spent.

[00:48:28] Adam Cox: Oh. This is giving me anxiety.

[00:48:30] Kyle Risi: And of course with Roxanne, under all the strain of keeping them afloat, a very deep riff formed between them. It's sort of Meg and Cain against Roxanne at one point, Adam, they are in the final run up to the convention and they just completely stopped talking to Roxanne altogether, which means the areas they're responsible for, they completely collapse with Roxanne not there to pick up the slack. Mm-hmm. Because they, she doesn't know what they're not doing.

[00:48:56] Adam Cox: Yeah.

[00:48:57] Kyle Risi: So they miss deadlines all over the place.

It's unfortunately at this point that Roxanne notices that they do not have enough money to literally keep going.

And when she flags this to the others, they just completely ignore it. It's all via email. They're not answering their emails in the first place, and when she's raising legitimate concerns, they're not getting back to her.

[00:49:15] Adam Cox: I mean, this must be quite good for a 19-year-old. Okay. It's clearly not gonna go to plan, but she's got a lot of good experience of how things can go wrong.

[00:49:23] Kyle Risi: Yeah. I've dealt with, uh, literal adult children.

[00:49:27] Adam Cox: Yeah.

[00:49:27] Kyle Risi: And so Roxanne has no choice but to look for how, wherever she can, one of those people is a woman from Australia.

Now, we don't actually know what her name is because in the fallout of what's to come, she doesn't want to be associated with this. But in the documentary I watched, they called her Sue.

[00:49:43] Adam Cox: Oh. So is her identity disguised then during

[00:49:46] Kyle Risi: No, she's just not in it.

[00:49:47] Adam Cox: Oh, okay.

[00:49:48] Kyle Risi: Her husband is in it.

[00:49:49] Adam Cox: Right.

[00:49:49] Kyle Risi: And he talks about what she went through, basically it's Sue who actually initially offers to help manage the social media for the convention. Simple and manageable. Especially considering Adam, she lives in Australia,

But two weeks later Meg asks her if she'll take over the artist's alley as a volunteer and Sue is like, what? Really? I, I don't have any experience

[00:50:11] Adam Cox: and Meg's like, neither do I.

Yeah,

[00:50:14] Kyle Risi: she makes it very clear that she's very nervous about this, but Meg just reassures her that she'll get the appropriate training beforehand.

Adam, that never happens. And so Sue has to work it all out for herself again from Australia. She's literally having to manage and organise a physical thing in another country from Australia

[00:50:33] Adam Cox: whilst me doing nothing.

[00:50:34] Kyle Risi: And all that ends up happening really is that Cain and Meg just end up dragging her into their personal drama with Roxanne.

So I know they're in their late twenties and Roxanne is just 19. But this is like high school stuff, isn't it? It's really unprofessional.

But Adam, it does get worse. With Meg being so useless and in charge of the panellists and guests, they are not being communicated with at all.

They wanna know basic things like, where am I staying? How am I getting there? And what about the small matter of payment?

Many of them are told basically that they will be paid after the convention from all the ticket sales, but when they follow up with more questions, again, men just ignores them. And so loads of them just drop out.

[00:51:13] Adam Cox: Yeah. That's the one thing you've really gotta try and keep sweet is all the talent and artists.

[00:51:17] Kyle Risi: Yeah. Yes. The biggest blow comes when steam power giraffe. They pull out six months before because Meg isn't checking her emails. She doesn't know which Adam means that can Roxanne don't know either.

And so as a result, they don't update the website and so people are still buying their supplementary tickets to see them. It's only a few weeks before the convention is due to start that they finally make the announcements that steam power giraffe will not be attending and they say, sorry, will not be refunding anyone who's ready for a ticket.

[00:51:47] Adam Cox: That's terrible.

[00:51:48] Kyle Risi: That's awful.

So they could have known, I wouldn't be even been surprised if that was an excuse and they did know they pulled that, but they were like, we could do it the extra money.

[00:51:54] Adam Cox: That's what I mean. Oh, could they have not have found a replacement? Because that happens, right? PE That does happen. Yeah. But as long as you've got a replacement.

[00:52:02] Kyle Risi: Yeah. I guess maybe they might have tried, but they weren't successful with it.

One guy says that he was literally planning. On driving 15 hours to see steam power giraffe. That was the only reason he was there.

And now they're refusing to refund him, and now he's going for nothing almost.

So I left the behind the scenes context a little late. But now you can essentially appreciate a little more that by the time this convention rolls around, things are in total disarray behind the scenes.

[00:52:27] Adam Cox: Yeah. In some ways I'm kind of impressed that they were able to do so much. It felt like they had a lot of interest and they got a lot of the right ideas.

[00:52:35] Kyle Risi: Mm-hmm.

[00:52:36] Adam Cox: They just weren't very good at executing it.

[00:52:38] Kyle Risi: So Adam, on Thursday, the 10th of July, the night before the convention begins, guests start arriving and some of the guests say that when they arrived, their first red flag was that the hotel was too nice.

[00:52:50] Adam Cox: Oh. So they were like, hang on a minute.

Yeah.

[00:52:52] Kyle Risi: Yeah. Of course, the hotel's still running on the expectation that they're gonna be an estimated between 3,507,000 guests attending on day one, 300 people show up.

[00:53:03] Adam Cox: But has this been booked already? These hotel rooms?

[00:53:06] Kyle Risi: For many of the guests and panellists, yes they have.

Yes. Mm-hmm. And I guess like people don't necessarily need to be staying at the convention centre, so they'd be staying somewhere else, right? Mm-hmm.

But Adam, these 300 guests showing up is only 7% of their highest estimates. So it's not good.

And straightaway the hotel is very suspicious and also very worried because remember the attendees coming through the doors is how they're gonna get paid, right?

[00:53:29] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:53:30] Kyle Risi: On arrival, guests are directed to the convention room to pick up their badges.

It's maybe 50,000 square feet with a solid, polished concrete floor, Adam. It is empty except for a small registration table set up at the far fucking end of the room with two volunteers waiting there.

Like it is awkward walking all the way with just two people smiling at you waving, but you're not close enough for you to kind of speak to them. But like, you have to maintain eye contact. It's just very awkward, I imagine is awkward.

[00:54:03] Adam Cox: Okay.

[00:54:03] Kyle Risi: The only thing I can think that would make this even more awkward, if they had one of those like rope sanctions set up that you have to snake,

[00:54:12] Adam Cox: that would've been horrendous.

[00:54:13] Kyle Risi: So people get their badges. The next thing that they can do is go and enjoy the games room. Right. There's a big feature thing of the convention.

Again, it's a huge convention hall, Adam, with a single table set up at the far end of it with a single games console on it.

[00:54:28] Adam Cox: What?

[00:54:29] Kyle Risi: Yeah. Like this is another red flag for the hotel. Like they're saying, hang on, they're expecting 7,000 guests. Why is there just one games console set up in this games room? Like people are gonna be waiting a hell of a long time for their turn.

[00:54:41] Adam Cox: Yeah.

[00:54:42] Kyle Risi: Also waiting around is a nightmare because Adam, the wifi, remember these are very online people.

[00:54:47] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[00:54:48] Kyle Risi: Doesn't work.

[00:54:49] Adam Cox: Okay. So that's poor planning.

[00:54:51] Kyle Risi: But it's okay because people can go and check out the awesome ball pit that has been hyped up for the last year. Right. The thing that this entire convention hinges on.

[00:55:02] Adam Cox: Right. Yeah. I wanna see an impressive ball pit.

[00:55:05] Kyle Risi: People go to yet another conference hall, 20,000 feet. Concrete floors, again, completely empty, except in the centre there is a kiddie size inflatable pool Oh god. With 300 plastic balls in it. Ah. It's barely big enough to fit four people.

[00:55:22] Adam Cox: No,

[00:55:24] Kyle Risi: hardly anyone uses it, because by the end of that day, rumours, it circulated that someone from the four chan fandom community mm-hmm. Had peed in it. So nobody wants to go near it.

Do you wanna see a picture of it?

[00:55:39] Adam Cox: Yes.

[00:55:40] Kyle Risi: Describe this for us, Adam.

[00:55:41] Adam Cox: Oh my God. Oh God.

[00:55:43] Kyle Risi: What do you see?

[00:55:45] Adam Cox: Um, it is a giant hall and there is a tiny little ball pit in the middle of it. Do you know? It looks like they've cleared out the hall and they couldn't take everything with them, so they just left a ball pit behind.

[00:55:59] Kyle Risi: It's so tragic. But it's the sheer scale of the room and how tall the ceilings are. Mm-hmm. And the walls that just make it look so bad.

[00:56:08] Adam Cox: I, how did they go through with this? This should have been called off. Just refund whatever. I, I don't know. But they've gone ahead with it. What do they think was gonna happen

[00:56:17] Kyle Risi: so bad? So it's Friday morning. All the guests are now starting to arrive. It's 9:00 AM There's literally nothing to do. And it's because the first event, Adam isn't scheduled to start till 1:00 PM

Adam. Question is, where are the organisers at this moment in time? Well, Roxanne, bless her. She's doing her best, right? She's helping guests. She's running all over the place. She's trying to sort out all the equipment for the panellists.

She's collecting stray balls of the spilled out of the ball pit.

Megan Ryan, on the other hand, they are still in bed. They got drunk the night before and were hungover in their rooms.

Adam, they are around so little for this convention that security don't even recognise who they are.

[00:56:57] Adam Cox: So I really feel for Roxanne. Yeah. She is like, determined to make the best of a bad situation.

[00:57:05] Kyle Risi: Uhhuh

[00:57:05] Adam Cox: the other two. They must know this is a disaster.

[00:57:08] Kyle Risi: Yeah, they must do. Bless her, Roxanne. She is trying to get them going.

But they hate her so much. and So rather than getting the convention going hungover in their room, they are busy drafting a legal letter to Roxanne to sign that, in effect demotes her to their secretary. That's what they're preoccupied with at this moment in time.

[00:57:27] Adam Cox: I mean, yeah. Worry about that after the event. Does Roxanne sign this?

[00:57:32] Kyle Risi: Of course she does not sign this.

She's

[00:57:34] Adam Cox: technically the boss right now.

[00:57:35] Kyle Risi: Yeah. She's like the balls are the Pitney collecting up. I don't have time to sign it.

So with no leadership, volunteers are literally just standing around waiting for someone to tell them what to do.

Sue and her husband, who remember flew all the way from Australia for this, for this. They are literally doing anything they can.

They have been working nonstop since they got there. They haven't even had time to put their bags in their room, Eventually though, at 5:00 PM they do get a chance just to chill for five minutes. In between Sue having to host two panels that are scheduled for that evening, they decide to go to their rooms to drop the bags off, only to find that their key cards do not work.

Now they're told by the front desk that there is a payment issue, and so while they wait for it to be sorted out, a group of the guests at the convention, they approach them asking whether or not the rumours they've just heard are true.

[00:58:26] Adam Cox: Oh God, what are the rumours?

[00:58:27] Kyle Risi: Sue and Matt are like, what the fuck are you talking about? And so the guests, they put out their phones and they see that Megan Kane had posted on the website that the hotel was demanding $17,000 by 10:00 PM that night. Otherwise they were gonna shut down the convention.

[00:58:43] Adam Cox: Oh God.

[00:58:44] Kyle Risi: The reason Adam, that they give for this is because the hotel didn't like the convention goers.

[00:58:50] Adam Cox: Really? Oh, so this is what Meg Cain had said? Yeah. Okay.

[00:58:54] Kyle Risi: The truth was the hotel we're looking at the numbers of people that were there and thinking to themselves, if our payment is based on these ticket sales, there's no way that we're gonna be getting our money. And so for assurance, they want their money like right there.

And then

[00:59:06] Adam Cox: I'm surprised a hotel would've like accepted this already. Like they would want pre-booked rooms or a prebook, right? Sure. Or at

[00:59:14] Kyle Risi: least, it's a rookie mistake from them. I guess they just trusted, like they maybe came across really credible.

[00:59:19] Adam Cox: They trusted Meg Cain and Roxanne. Yeah. I trust Roxanne among the other two.

[00:59:24] Kyle Risi: Now listen, I really hate side with a hotel here, but in this case, I think the hotel is being very reasonable in asking for the money upfront.

[00:59:32] Adam Cox: They're business at the end of the day.

[00:59:34] Kyle Risi: So next, Meg, Ken, and Roxanne, they gather everyone into a room. This is all the convention goers. Oh. And again, they explain the situation that they need $17,000. Otherwise the convention is over OVAH.

[00:59:48] Adam Cox: So they're gonna ask these Teenage kids have already paid for a ticket that have travelled across the world. The volunteers, I'm guessing as well. To basically cough up a hundred. How much are they gonna do? A hundred, 200 each.

[00:59:59] Kyle Risi: It's mental.

They direct everyone to their website. They point to the big blue donate button and essentially beg everyone to just donate anything they can, saying that they'll pay everyone back from the door sales that they get across the rest of the weekend. Then they say, guys, we have one hour.

Obviously it is carnage. People are initially outraged, but weirdly not so much the organisers

[01:00:20] Adam Cox: at the hotel.

[01:00:21] Kyle Risi: Yeah, because the threat is all rooted in the hotel not liking them, this lie.

So it becomes a sort of a rally against the machine and one by one Adam, the entire room. They start throwing up the three finger salute from the Hunger Games.

Like that symbol of oppression.

[01:00:40] Adam Cox: I mean, it's definitely not the same. Let's not even draw comparisons.

[01:00:45] Kyle Risi: And while they're doing that, the, organisers, they start passing around a literal bag. In some of the footage you do see Lachlan going around with her little bag. So she's involved, but she's not the cause of this mess.

[01:00:55] Adam Cox: I bet she's thinking at this point in time, she's, I really wish I never suggested

[01:00:59] Kyle Risi: her. Yeah, she's cringing. She's so cringing, so hard. Someone else is going around with a computer to take like PayPal payments, most pay in cash. They're not given a receipt, so how they're gonna pay everyone back at the end of the convention is going to be impossible.

But no one's thinking that right now, everyone, while they're collecting the money, starts singing. Lame is, oh my God, do you hear the people sing? Which iconically is a rallying cry of the oppressed masses against the tyranny.

In this case, the hotel.

[01:01:32] Adam Cox: Is this why you were singing this the other day?

[01:01:36] Kyle Risi: We were in Berlin and I just kept singing it and I was, he was like, why are you singing that? I'm like, you'll see,

[01:01:41] Adam Cox: oh, this is ridiculous. This is what happens when you, I don't know, get these enthusiastic,

[01:01:48] Kyle Risi: very online people.

[01:01:49] Adam Cox: Yes.

[01:01:50] Kyle Risi: In this bubble.

[01:01:51] Adam Cox: I don't wanna say nerds. But they are very enthusiastic.

[01:01:53] Kyle Risi: Yeah. Very young angsty teens, Adam.

Amazingly, after one hour, they raised the money.

[01:01:59] Adam Cox: Wow.

[01:02:00] Kyle Risi: They literally shake down all these teenagers. 17,000. When they break the news that they did it, the footage of them cheering is just amazing. Everyone bursts out singing. We are the champions, Adam. It's wild and hilarious.

Guys, if you get a chance in the show notes, I've left the link. Go and watch this video is wild.

[01:02:20] Adam Cox: Okay, so they've raised 17,000, but does that mean that poor Sue and her husband gets to go to the hotel room?

[01:02:27] Kyle Risi: Well, after the convention is saved, Sue and Matt head back to their room to finally relax again. Their key is disabled.

[01:02:35] Adam Cox: This is, I, I know

[01:02:37] Kyle Risi: this time it's not because of a payment issue. Meg and Kane have literally cancelled their rooms. Ah, yeah. When they paid their bill, they also gave the hotel a list of rooms that they were no longer willing to pay for.

This was so they could reduce that $17,000 bill and then keep the difference for themselves.

[01:02:54] Adam Cox: Oh, really?

[01:02:55] Kyle Risi: Yes. Is this scandalous bastard? I feel so awful for Poor Sue and Matt in the end. Sue has just had enough and she and Matt, they just leave.

They check themselves into a different hotel and they completely abandoned the convention altogether.

[01:03:10] Adam Cox: Good. Go do some sighting. Yeah,

[01:03:12] Kyle Risi: but it's not just Sue and Matt's room that they cancel. It's also some of the other panellists who have to figure that out for themselves when they arrive.

But also the volunteers who have promised the comp room, they literally now have nowhere to sleep after putting in an entire day's worth of work.

But remember, this is day one. And so some of these volunteers will obviously be working across the weekend. And so if they've got nowhere to stay, do you think they're gonna be sticking around?

[01:03:39] Adam Cox: No.

[01:03:40] Kyle Risi: No.

[01:03:41] Adam Cox: No, they're not.

[01:03:43] Kyle Risi: And so Adam, like I said, this is day one of DashCon

[01:03:46] Adam Cox: How are Meg and Kane getting away with this?

[01:03:49] Kyle Risi: I don't know. But how anxious would you be feeling at this moment in time as an organiser?

[01:03:53] Adam Cox: Oh, if I was Roxanne, she's like, they've done what

[01:03:55] Kyle Risi: now? Yeah. By this point the internet have gotten wind at something is off. Remember, this is

[01:04:02] Adam Cox: what was the first clue.

[01:04:05] Kyle Risi: Remember, this is a Tumblr convention for people who are very much online. The internet becomes awash with people taking the piss out of them. And the organisers with a focus on this hurried 17,000, essentially shakedown of their guests.

[01:04:20] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[01:04:20] Kyle Risi: And so late into the night, Megan Kane, rather than preparing for the next day, they're in damage control mode.

They post an explanation that explains what went wrong, along with pictures and bills and contracts just to justify what was going on.

It's the usual PR bullshit and they blame the hotel and operational issues. Of course, people don't buy this, especially when someone looks very closely at the receipts that Meg and Kane have posted online and they calculate that they weren't short $17,000. It was more like they were short a few thousand dollars.

And the implication here is that they fleece all these kids of all their money, sung a few show tunes, cancelled a bunch of people's room, and then pocketed a huge, huge difference for themselves.

[01:05:06] Adam Cox: So like they've kept what, like 10, 12 grand or something?

[01:05:08] Kyle Risi: Yeah. Isn't that wild?

[01:05:10] Adam Cox: I can't believe that.

[01:05:12] Kyle Risi: So Adam is now day two.

Saturday, a few more people show up, but again, nowhere near close to what they expected and certainly nowhere near what the hotel has expected.

Day two is also the day of the flagship event where, welcome to the Veil, we'll now be doing their live show. People gather into the convention hall at 12:00 PM at noon.

[01:05:33] Adam Cox: Is it a really empty hall?

[01:05:34] Kyle Risi: No. There's a bunch of people in there. Everyone's pretty much there to see them. They can't help notice though that nothing seems to be set up on stage. There's no banners, there's no posters, there's no speakers or mics around, you know, 1250 rolls around and still welcome to the veil have not shown up. And again, nobody is still setting anything up. Like it's almost an hour late.

[01:05:56] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[01:05:56] Kyle Risi: Surely they'd be setting up the mics and the ROA Pro and all that stuff. Do you know what I mean?

[01:06:00] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[01:06:01] Kyle Risi: Well, it turns out, Adam, that months before Welcome to the Veil had been insisting that they wouldn't be performing unless they were paid beforehand.

Meg didn't get back to them, and so by the time she did, they had pulled out.

And so Meg and Kane knew this, and yet they let everyone gather into their hall and wait for 50 minutes.

[01:06:19] Adam Cox: So not only did they know that the draught people weren't gonna make it

[01:06:23] Kyle Risi: mm-hmm.

[01:06:23] Adam Cox: That they, I guess did they realise that, oh, we can't cancel two headline acts, so therefore we'll just say that they didn't turn up on the day.

[01:06:30] Kyle Risi: Yeah. Isn't that awful? Here's the kicker. The reason why they left everyone to wait 50 minutes is because they were scurrying to scrub the website that said nobody would be getting any refunds.

[01:06:42] Adam Cox: Wow.

[01:06:43] Kyle Risi: Finally, at 1:20 PM they sent Paul Roxanne in to explain that the show was not going to go ahead. Literally everyone in the room collectively is like, what the fuck?

And she's anticipating this and Roxanne is like, hold her hands up and is like, listen, if everyone would like to collectively all join me, we can all side together.

[01:07:04] Adam Cox: I'm, I'm sorry, what?

[01:07:06] Kyle Risi: She says, that's what I've been doing, so let's just take a second to all do that. And she's like 3, 2, 1. Everyone's eyes and you just hear one guy in the background scream, give me back my money. That's the only clear bit of body you can hear.

[01:07:22] Adam Cox: Why are they not outraged? Why are they so placid by this?

[01:07:25] Kyle Risi: I know it's so bad. So following this, it's of course more damage control. The organisers, they submit a post with yet another explanation for the cancellation, and they say, of course, we're very, very sorry, blah, blah, blah.

For those who had reserved a seat, we will be placing you into a raffle where you'll be in for a chance to win. A framed Stanley autograph, a framed Richard Armitage autograph, a framed walking dead photo with the full cast autographs and assigned Martin Freeman autograph and more so many cool prizes, basically.

[01:07:58] Adam Cox: Yeah, no, I want my

[01:07:59] Kyle Risi: money back. A raffle. A raffle. Yeah. So you are in for a chance, but also we're giving you guys, are you ready for this?

An extra hour in the ball bullpen. Oh my god. Like the bullpen isn't even a time detraction, people aren't queuing up to get in it. An extra hour is not something anybody wants.

[01:08:20] Adam Cox: Like you can barely spend 30 seconds in there, let alone an hour.

[01:08:27] Kyle Risi: But this is the moment that basically becomes this symbol for this failure that is this convention. People start mocking it relentlessly online. But Adam, it's not now on Tumblr, it's all over Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, memes are flying all over the place. It literally becomes the symbol for what the shit show had become.

[01:08:45] Adam Cox: Is this why Tumblr shut down? Because they're like, they're tied to this.

[01:08:50] Kyle Risi: Adam. The crazy thing is that even years later at other conventions and at Halloween, people literally dress up as a ball pit some of the costumes are just amazing.

One girl makes a sort of dress that curls up, that contains all the balls around her, and then on her back she says, won an extra hour.

So with all the backlash happening online, the press and the media and obviously millions of other people online, they start looking into them a little bit more closely. And they start to notice there is a very clear affiliation with a charity called Random Acts.

So when the media goes to random acts for a comment, they're very surprised to see their name on the website and they end up releasing a statement saying that they categorically had nothing to do with this convention whatsoever.

In fact, have no record of any of the organisers ever making contact with them.

[01:09:42] Adam Cox: Wow. They just stuck the logo on the website.

[01:09:45] Kyle Risi: Yeah. So bad. But welcome to the Nightvale is not the only disappointment Many of the other panellists scheduled to appear, arrive, but straight away, of course, they find out that their rooms have been cancelled and so they just leave and they're not sticking around for this bullshit.

[01:09:58] Adam Cox: And did the panel for BDSM ever? Go ahead.

[01:10:02] Kyle Risi: I think so. I think it did. People who rented booths, obviously, remember they rented those for $150 a pop to sell merchandise and commissions in the artist alley. They sell literally nothing and it's because all the guests have given their money to the convention that's $17,000.

So they've got nothing to spend. Ah, one of the panellists who does show up is a guy called ND Stevenson. He's like an American cartoonist. Because. All of the moderators had pulled out. He has to moderate his own panel. He's essentially interviewing himself.

He's like, whoa, what's that? How did I first get into cartooning? Great question. Me, Adam. Long story short, this convention sucked the ball pit balls.

[01:10:47] Adam Cox: Um, so how many people actually turned up in the end?

[01:10:50] Kyle Risi: Oh, nowhere close to 3,500, I don't think. Yeah, God. So on Sunday morning, it's very clear to everyone, including Meg, Cain and Roxanne, that this is just a complete dud.

They decide that they are going to host an apology panel.

[01:11:03] Adam Cox: Oh my God. Well, no,

no

[01:11:04] Kyle Risi: more

[01:11:05] Adam Cox: panels.

[01:11:05] Kyle Risi: they're going face to face with everyone that they're pissed off That could have just been another email. Like people are literally gonna kill them.

Basically, Meg says there were a lot of mistakes made on a lot of different people's parts, and we apologise for the parts that were us. It's all you. But at the same time she has your audacity to say, don't worry. Dash guard 2015 is going to be much better.

[01:11:28] Adam Cox: Yeah. Like they're coming back.

[01:11:30] Kyle Risi: Of course, everyone leaves on Sunday with a feeling that they have been scammed.

[01:11:34] Adam Cox: Yeah this is their weekend. they could have done anything. Yeah. And they've basically just been scammed outta money.

[01:11:39] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[01:11:39] Adam Cox: And gone and stood in a paddling pool.

[01:11:42] Kyle Risi: They could have literally stayed at home on Tumblr and had a better time.

[01:11:45] Adam Cox: Yes. Maybe this is a lesson.

[01:11:47] Kyle Risi: Don't venture into the IRL world.

[01:11:50] Adam Cox: Yes. Stay on blr.

[01:11:52] Kyle Risi: However, though, Adam, some people do see it for what it was, some people do see this as a very poorly managed event by organisers who were very clearly inexperienced.

Online though memes are still flying all over the place, but eventually anger does set in and with good reason. Like, remember some people, they drove like 15 hours just to be there. Sue and Matt, they flew from fucking Australia. Guess who were there now? Just wanted their money back.

Mm-hmm. And so the online discourse around this, just gets very loud. And so eventually the organisers, they just cannot ignore this. But there was nothing that they could do. They literally had no money to refund anyone.

The only thing that they could do was stand firm and say that they would be upholding their rules on no refunds. The rules remember that they changed midway through the convention.

[01:12:43] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm. So they, they were offering refunds at one point

[01:12:46] Kyle Risi: until it all started going to shit. Yeah. And they realised they were gonna have to refund a lot of people.

[01:12:50] Adam Cox: The thing is, this could have been quite a successful convention. Mm-hmm. 'Cause there was a lot of interest. They'd managed to get some big names in that world at least interested or initially signed, had it been properly, like predeep deposits or anything like part payment.

[01:13:06] Kyle Risi: Answered emails.

[01:13:07] Adam Cox: Answered emails. It could have been a, I think they were a bit too ambitious in the venue and the amount of people. They should have perhaps just sacked Megan Kane. Roxanne should have just done it by herself. With Sue.

[01:13:17] Kyle Risi: With Sue. I reckon Sue could have done it. As for the organisers, Meg, she leaves DashCon fully intending to do a better job next year.

[01:13:25] Adam Cox: What she did? Nothing.

[01:13:27] Kyle Risi: I know, I know. Of course. To distance themselves from DashCon, the next convention is not gonna be called DashCon. They change it to emoticon, which I don't get.

[01:13:37] Adam Cox: emoticon. Isn't that like what the emojis are called? Before they were called emojis.

[01:13:41] Kyle Risi: Oh really? I don't know, maybe like a vintage kind of throwback, retro thing. But online people, they're not dumb. They very quickly work out who she is and she just ends up getting mocked relentlessly.

And in her defence, she does try to put a lot of the blame on Roxanne, which is just so mean.

She seems to be the only one who's generally trying to make the convention work on the discussion boards. What they do is Megan came, they set up like an autocorrect of any mention of Roxanne, and they have that be changed to Al, which does not go down well at all. 'Cause remember, this is also the era where anti-bullying campaigns really start to kind of ramp up as well. And so they get accused of bullying real bad.

[01:14:22] Adam Cox: Yeah. They're being trolls.

[01:14:23] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[01:14:24] Adam Cox: They ship it on Rocklands, panel. Ask a troll.

[01:14:27] Kyle Risi: The backlash gets so bad that Meg is forced to abandon their whole idea of another convention altogether.

[01:14:32] Adam Cox: Good.

[01:14:33] Kyle Risi: And so DashCon two dies with that, and later it comes out that Meg actually got fired from her regular job and as a result she was FALs to file for bankruptcy. And Adam, it's probably because like her employer realises that she was spending most of her time trying to get this convention going rather than doing her actual job.

[01:14:50] Adam Cox: That doesn't seem like she was doing either job.

[01:14:52] Kyle Risi: No. Doesn't, does it? Apparently today she spends most of her time roleplaying Homestuck online, which I don't, there's some kind of cosplay thing.

Cain. However, he continues down the wrong path after DashCon and eventually is busted for shoplifting at Walmart.

So, very classy guy. And to this day, he's still lying about his identity, basically, that he went to an Ivy League school. Like people pro disprove that very early on. He says that his real birth name is Loki to kind of time to Tom Hiddleston. Like it's just, he's a troll.

[01:15:21] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm. Yeah. He's still in a make believe world.

[01:15:23] Kyle Risi: They are still pariahs amongst the online communities today and are being accused of essentially stealing DashCon funds by not refunding anyone.

Yeah. Apparently though, Roxanne, she's doing really well and in light of all the bullying, she ends up hiring a lawyer who helps her gain access to the DashCon Corporation in an attempt to try and put things right.

So at least she tried. She didn't really make too much of a dent. The positive thing is, is that none of these three people are in a position to ever host another convention.

[01:15:52] Adam Cox: Good number one. But then a Roxanne, like I feel like she probably could do it if she had the right business partners.

[01:15:58] Kyle Risi: Yes. I think if she wanted to make a go, I think she seems to have the right work ethic and her priorities in order,

[01:16:04] Adam Cox: yeah. To

[01:16:04] Kyle Risi: potentially pull this off.

[01:16:05] Adam Cox: I imagine like in a job interview, they're like, describe a time, a stressful or challenging situation

[01:16:11] Kyle Risi: set up DashCon. I'm responsible for that. You are hired. If you could deal that stress. Yeah. Even if you failed, we'll take you on.

[01:16:19] Adam Cox: Yeah.

[01:16:20] Kyle Risi: and like DashCon by comparison is not the worst disaster to have happened, especially in comparison to the likes of the poop cruise or fire festival. Do you know what I mean?

So some of it is largely overblown. It did become a meme and a part of kind of internet folklore. Many of the guests who did attend. Did say yes, it was boring at times. And yes, some aspects were very disappointing, but they did get to meet a lot of their online friends and make new friends.

Right. Which kind of transcended back onto online.

[01:16:48] Adam Cox: Yes. But they probably could have done it for less money

[01:16:51] Kyle Risi: they could have done, but it's still an an IRL experience, if you will.

[01:16:55] Adam Cox: They've got, yeah. An experience that they all shared together.

[01:16:58] Kyle Risi: Yes.

[01:16:59] Adam Cox: But equally, 'cause you said oh, is this a scam or not a scam? Now that I know that they actually actively took money from customers.

[01:17:06] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[01:17:07] Adam Cox: It is a scam to be now. Yeah, up until that point, it was just a shit show. Then it was a scam.

[01:17:11] Kyle Risi: I think that's true. But the thing is though, a lot of these people that went to the convention, they all agree that it served as purpose. That's what the purpose of the convention was, to bring us together, to introduce us all in real life, to have a bridging across these different fandoms.

[01:17:24] Adam Cox: No,

[01:17:25] Kyle Risi: 500 should people

[01:17:26] Adam Cox: enough with this silver lining bullshit. It was a horrendous,

[01:17:30] Kyle Risi: uh, anyway, but a lot of the people that were there say like it wasn't as bad as the incident made it out to be because a lot of the footage and the firsthand account sort of concentrates all down to something that's really potent. So it looks really bad. But with that said.

In that potency. There are a lot of really funny, outrageous moments which you can go and watch on YouTube, especially the moments where they're all singing. Do you hear the people sing? And the kind of $17,000 shakedown, it's all very funny.

There's also a really great video online, which I will link to. It's from a creator called Sarah Z, who gives a very accurate overview of what it was actually like doing her best to separate the speculation from the facts.

So I do recommend if you want to dive deeper into the story, then go check out her video, which I'll link into the show notes.

But because of the impact that DashCon 2014 had in the online zeitgeist in 2025, Adam, a new set of Tumblr users did band together with a bit more organisation Between the organisers to host. DashCon two, which actually happened in Toronto in July, 2025. So last year.

[01:18:33] Adam Cox: And was it a success?

[01:18:35] Kyle Risi: Yeah, Adam, they did the smart thing and they started small, just three to 500 people in attendance with some actual professionals involved in making this a reality.

And it's because it becomes like internet law. Mm-hmm. Like it was mythical. It was legendary that they thought let's lean on in this and make this a reality. Let's really do it properly.

[01:18:51] Adam Cox: Anything was gonna be better than last time.

[01:18:53] Kyle Risi: Yes. It featured events. Like another artist Alley had a bunch of panels, which included one titled Raccoons by Lachlan O'Neill.

[01:19:02] Adam Cox: Oh, so she was back.

[01:19:03] Kyle Risi: Yeah, she came back. So she didn't go into hiding basically.

[01:19:06] Adam Cox: What about raccoons?

[01:19:08] Kyle Risi: Marrying them to other creatures. Animal husbandry.

[01:19:11] Adam Cox: She's

[01:19:12] Kyle Risi: still, obviously

[01:19:12] Adam Cox: she hasn't grown out of that.

[01:19:14] Kyle Risi: No. Why should she

they also had drag shows that a charity raffle something called exquisite Corpse drawing. Apparently he was very good.

And of course they had a ball pit as a nod to the thing that made DashCon infamous. And it was even smaller.

[01:19:30] Adam Cox: Was it small? I was wondering if it's like behind glass. It's almost like a museum or a relic. Yeah.

[01:19:37] Kyle Risi: And Adam, that is the story of DashCon 2014.

[01:19:40] Adam Cox: Wow. That was stupid.

[01:19:44] Kyle Risi: So good, wasn't it? But yeah, it was a benign story. Yes, you're right. I guess in the end when we look back at it, they were being scammed, but I think they had the best intentions.

[01:19:54] Adam Cox: Yeah. When they had the idea online, that's when they should have stopped.

[01:19:56] Kyle Risi: Yes. Let's just keep this a fantasy.

[01:19:58] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[01:19:59] Kyle Risi: Would you like to go to DashCon 2026?

[01:20:01] Adam Cox: Absolutely. Not

[01:20:03] Kyle Risi: really.

[01:20:04] Adam Cox: Don't act so

[01:20:06] Kyle Risi: surprised. I would. But you've never been to a convention so I think we should go and if we are gonna go to one, it should be like a good one.

[01:20:13] Adam Cox: I don't need to see a talk on raccoons.

[01:20:15] Kyle Risi: I've only been to one convention that was at the UEA and it's exactly what you expect. Like just loads of like booths and stands and stores, loads of people signing autographs. I used to work for a comic bookstore as well, no interest in it. But part of my job was to help organise some of the events that we're hosting and we would get a lot of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, actors on.

Mm-hmm. We had Julie Bens, she's the famously, the very first vampire ever to appear on Buffy the Vampire Slayer. She's also in Desperate Housewives. Uh, she's also Dexter's wife in, in Dexter.

[01:20:45] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[01:20:46] Kyle Risi: And basically she would just sign a bunch of v graphs, like she just signed maybe a hundred at 10 bucks a pop. That's a thousand dollars, right?

[01:20:53] Adam Cox: Mm-hmm.

[01:20:53] Kyle Risi: A lot of money. I also met, Andy Hallett. Do you remember him?

[01:20:57] Adam Cox: Yeah. Didn't he play LA or something?

[01:20:59] Kyle Risi: Yeah, he played LA in Angel. and, um, He came over with Julie Ben, but before he actually arrived, he actually cancelled because he literally had a heart attack that week and like a minor heart attack. And he pulled out.

But then the doctor gave him the all clear and he decided actually he'll come to the uk, he'll do the panel and then he'll just spend a week here. And Dave and Richard, my bosses at the time, they were like, you can stay with us no problem. And you can have Kyle that will look after you for the entire week.

And we had a bloody good time. He told me like this really incredible story about how one night he was walking through Beverly Hills and he got really drunk. And his mates ended up throwing him in like a trash bin, but it just so happened to be the trash bin of Monica Lewinsky's parents.

Oh really? And so within minutes there was an entire SWAT team surrounding this bin, armed gun's pointing at him, telling him to get out of this bin and he had to climb out this bin.

[01:21:50] Adam Cox: So it looked like what he was trying to find ev evidence or something like stupid. I

[01:21:53] Kyle Risi: dunno what it, I just guess like it triggered the alarms.

[01:21:56] Adam Cox: Right. Yeah.

[01:21:56] Kyle Risi: And and yeah, and we gave him a haircut. We famously snipped his ear and he blood pouring down. I've got a video of him like maybe I'll see if I can find it. And I posted it online. You

[01:22:05] Adam Cox: snipped his ear?

[01:22:06] Kyle Risi: I didn't, David sniped his ear, give him a haircut 'cause he needed a haircut. But yeah, sadly he ended up dying I think a few years later from an actual heart attack. Mm-hmm. I think he was like only early forties.

But yeah, that's my only experience of, of a, of a convention I guess.

[01:22:20] Adam Cox: Yeah. That's quite cool story.

[01:22:21] Kyle Risi: Anyway, Adam, defence doing some shout outs.

[01:22:23] Adam Cox: Yes, so this is the part of the show where we remind you that the compendium is not just a podcast, we're a literal functioning circus and a legally regulated place of work. Who is hiring?

[01:22:33] Kyle Risi: Yes, we guys, we are desperate for more applications. It's a little bit hidden on our website, but if you go to the compendium podcast.com, click the jobs tab, it's just right there in the footer, and you can browse through our bizarre collection of jobs.

Go ahead, select your favourite and apply, and we will read the best one out on a future episode, but it's now time to shine the spotlight on our favourite job application for this week.

Who is,

I don't know, I think this name is made up. Prudence Tule. Hi Prudence. Prudence is our Assistant Director of Unauthorised Whistling. Prudence role is to track rogue Whistlers issue formal cautions and maintains the official whistle register. Also investigates whistle motives, confiscates suspicious tunes, and enforces designated whistling hours between 0 5, and four 10. That's it.

[01:23:25] Adam Cox: How does she spot this?

[01:23:26] Kyle Risi: I dunno what we're gonna find out. She also escalates repeat offenders to the tribunal of, stop that immediately. Chaired by someone who has heard too much.

Okay.

That's enough whistling. do you wanna read us out? Prudence, day-to-day responsibilities.

[01:23:40] Adam Cox: She says that she would patrol the circus for rogue whistling, suspicious humming, and anyone just making a little tune with her mouth, like some kind of freelance flute.

[01:23:50] Kyle Risi: Okay.

[01:23:50] Adam Cox: She says that I bring lived experience from growing up next door to a man who whistled Mambo number five whilst doing DIY.

I survived. He didn't, and now his body lies in a shallow grave somewhere. New Jersey. Wow. Prudence. That is dark.

[01:24:07] Kyle Risi: Sounds really dark.

[01:24:09] Adam Cox: You went there.

That is the kind of tolerance I will bring to the role. Zero. Brilliant.

In 2022, I identified a covert whistling grandpa by the hot dog stand. After three notes, green sleeves. He claimed he was just breathing. But put it this way, he ain't breathing no more.

[01:24:29] Kyle Risi: Oh God.

[01:24:29] Adam Cox: As a warning, but officially a token. I keep his lips on a string around my neck.

Wow. Guys, there was also an instant involving a kazoo, a vicar, and a damp tea towel. But for legal reasons, Sue says, I can't say anymore about that incident as a KPI self-assessment, whistling detection, 94%. That's pretty good.

[01:24:52] Kyle Risi: Yeah.

[01:24:52] Adam Cox: A confirmed kill. I don't remember setting that. KPI, uh, she says 12 people.

[01:24:58] Kyle Risi: Wow. Wow.

[01:24:59] Adam Cox: And ability to let things go. Absolutely none.

[01:25:02] Kyle Risi: Wow. Probably one of my favourites so far.

[01:25:06] Adam Cox: Yeah. Who knew?

[01:25:08] Kyle Risi: So guys, if you wanna be featured on a future episode, remember to head over to the convention podcast.com, search for jobs in the footer, pick your role, and send us your application. We will read the best ones on a future episode.

[01:25:20] Adam Cox: right then. Shall we run the outro for this week?

[01:25:23] Kyle Risi: I am ready, Adam.

And so that brings us to the end of another fascinating foray into the compendium and assembly of fascinating things we hope you enjoyed the ride as much as we did.

[01:25:32] Adam Cox: And if today's episode has sparked your curiosity, then please do us a favour and follow us on your favourite podcast app.

It truly makes a world of difference and helps more people discover the show. We end up in their feed.

[01:25:42] Kyle Risi: We do, yes. And remember, for our dedicated freaks out there, don't forget the next week's episode is already waiting for you on our Patreon. And as always, it's completely free to access.

[01:25:51] Adam Cox: And if you want even more, then you can join our certified freaks tier.

To unlock the entire archive. You get to delve into some exclusive content and get a sneak peek at what's coming next.

[01:26:00] Kyle Risi: We drop new episodes every Tuesday and until then, remember, online hype is not the same as real life.

We'll see next time.

[01:26:08] Adam Cox: See you.